anders_CPH said:The manufacturing argument is the underrated one.
Thank you — that is the clearest version of this I have read, and I have read a lot of them.
From the other side of the consultation, briefly. Most of what circulates confidently in this community traces back to one summary of one study, and the qualifier was dropped somewhere in the third retelling.
Dr.Martinez said:The gap between trial results and real-world results is consistent and it is not fraud.
This is where I part company with the consensus forming above. I would add the less popular caveat: these trial populations under-represented several groups, older adults and the highest BMI categories among them. The results probably generalise, and "probably" should be stated as an assumption rather than dropped.
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View ResultsThe figures, for anyone assembling their own picture. If you are comparing against somebody else’s result, check that you are comparing the same measurement taken the same way. Most of the apparent contradictions in these threads dissolve at that step.
Correct me if the detail matters more than I have assumed.
Moderator note: leaving this open. It is being argued well and the disagreement is the useful part. No action needed from anybody.